The Boy Scouts and America’s growing rebellion against God

Well, how sad. In a move that makes no “carnal” or moral sense, the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) has decided to change its position and allow homosexual scouts but not homosexual leaders. If this is news to you, you can read about it here: “Boy Scouts vote to lift ban on [homosexual] youth” (or, frankly, you can read about it just about anywhere; the media seems to be having a party).

Looking purely from an argumentative standpoint, morality aside, the decision seems inept. It is not a compromise that will satisfy those behind the homosexual agenda in the matter. It is only a half-measure, and, as many have already made clear, they will not stop until the whole measure is in place: where distinctions between homosexual and heterosexual identifications play no role at all in Scout matters and homosexuals are allowed as leaders, as well. So the decision won’t end the social pressure. Nor will it change the legal standing of the group in any positive way. Actually it may make things worse, since one of the arguments, as I understand it, that the BSA made to maintain its policies against homosexual participants was that the policy reflected the position of the majority of those who sponsor Scouting, which would include many nominally Christian churches. The positions of those sponsors has not changed appreciably, so the BSA seems to be undercutting one of its own defenses. If the will of its sponsors makes no difference concerning who can be a scout, then why would it make a difference concerning who can be a leader? Again, there is no argumentative sense here.

That it makes no moral sense should be immediately obvious, but perhaps it isn’t so straightforward. The nature of homosexuality has not changed. A scout’s oath to “keep myself… morally straight” has not changed. The public’s opinion of homosexuality is certainly changing, however, so perhaps that’s where it makes sense. Perhaps the BSA has officially agreed that morality is relative and that our standards are completely defined by our society’s current fads and fascinations. If that’s the case, then other parts of the oath, such as “do[ing] my best to do my duty to God” is up for grabs, as well, I suppose.

Regardless, the bid to make it only a matter of accepting homosexual scouts but not homosexual adult leaders is doomed by this call. If one can be “morally straight” and a homosexual before becoming 18-years-old, what makes homosexuality at age 18 and after somehow no longer “morally straight”? If the definition is driven by public sentiment before 18, why is it suddenly an objective absolute after 18? Does a homosexual who has achieved the honored level of Eagle Scout, a recognition that a person is worthy of Scouting’s greatest honor, who turns 18 suddenly have to turn in all of his scouting ties and affiliations and leave the organization, because his age has made him suddenly dishonorable? One who has received the highest honor that Scouting can bestow on a person, representing in many ways the pinnacle of leadership, would be prevented from serving as a leader in the very organization that so recognized him? That doesn’t seem to make sense. I wouldn’t expect that to stand.

The comments I see being made by some BSA decision makers in this is that it will allow them to “serve more kids.” That would seem terribly short-sighted, not to mention rationally incoherent. If it’s a matter of numbers, they would be able to “serve more kids” if they opened up to girls, also. If they are thinking of dropping morality as an issue that they may open the doors wider, then they could, perhaps, “serve more kids” by taking in unrepentantly immoral youth of all sorts. The problem is that they are not simply increasing the numbers they serve in this way; rather, they are fundamentally transforming what it means to say they are “serving” them, at all.

Perhaps I will be surprised. Perhaps they will open the doors to youths who believe they are homosexuals and then be consistently on message that homosexuality is still immoral, and those scouts will be under positive pressure to change, as would any other scout engaged in behavior that is seen as violating their oath. I don’t see any evidence of that, but it is the only way I can imagine such a decision being made that is in any way conceivably consistent with logic and reason.

Well, that and then the possibility that the BSA now does feel that homosexuality is not immoral and that this was the biggest change that they thought they could enact without completely losing all support. Then the goal would be to purposefully undercut their previous arguments so as to have the other changes seem to be “forced” on them so that the end result is that homosexuality is no longer an issue in any way at all. That would be some cold calculating, but not impossible to imagine.

Anyway, my point is that when Mr. Meredith talks about the “falling away” or “rebellion” against God talked about in 2 Thess. 2:3, “Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away [or ‘rebellion’, ‘defection’, ‘revolt’, ‘turning away from a previous standing’] comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition,” we are seeing that happen around us.

His insight that this refers to something huge is not only sound biblically and in the proper use of the Greek language, but we see it reflected in the world around us. The Boy Scouts–a shining light to many who, for years, saw them as an example of an organization willing to stand for what was right no matter cost in public perception–provide yet another example.

Yes, it is true that in the end times many true Christians will turn from the faith–whether to the world’s counterfeit Christianity or to other alternatives. That is a given. Paul says, “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables” (2 Timothy 4:3-4).  As self-declared apostles, self-deluded prophets, and self-appointed teachers multiply, we see this happening at a seemingly increasing pace.

And, yes, it is true that outside the Church there is a vast deficit of the truth. For those whom God has not yet called, they simply do not have those precious truths God reveals only to those He is working with at this time–His Church. Actually being a Christian is more than being called a Christian. We’re hated for it, but we recognize that the “Christ” believed on by the vast majority of what is called “Christianity” is a “counterfeit Christ” — as Paul said, “another Jesus” (2 Cor. 11:4) and not the Jesus of the Bible.

But this does not mean that the rest of the world does not have any “truth” to fall away from or rebel against, at least not according to the Bible. Quite the contrary, consider how God speaks through the apostle of the Gentiles: “…for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness…” (Romans 2:14-15). Not that they had the fullness of God’s revelation, but, rather, that there are some things God has placed inherently within us concerning certain elements of morality. There is nothing in the human heart that inclines it to know that the seventh day is holy to God and should be kept holy. Yet, there is something that says, for instance, that parents are to be respected. And, frankly, that homosexuality is not right.

There is a reason that some moral principles are common even within heathen cultures. It’s the reason that those whom Paul describes as groping for God in their ignorance (Acts 17:27) do have some basic, simple principles of God’s Way inherent in their natures–not all of it by far, to be sure, as the entirety is only available through his revelation and the engagement of His Spirit (1 Cor. 2:14)–such that they are still accountable for their actions when they know they’ve done wrong, if not to the same degree as someone who has not only the basic, natural sense of right and wrong but also the revealed knowledge (Luke 12:47-48).

Yet, what we see around us today is an active casting aside of even those things God, in His mercy, made natural within mankind. Patriarchy-based leadership, the Godly structure of the family which has been most natural to civilization, has been on the outs for some time. We see the willingness of society to butcher its unborn children, the natural inclinations and maternal instinct God has placed within mankind, taking a prideful place as more than a right but, incredibly, a “moral” stand. The list could go on and on. But the BSA decision represents another chapter–or at the least a turn of the page in the same chapter–in this increasing rebellion against even the natural truths God has placed within His creation. Homosexual behavior is immoral. And the pride in those who would actively remove that conviction from our societies–both here and abroad–is revealing. It is the pride one sees in the revolutionary, standing against the establishment with “right” on his side. But the revolution is against God, and the “establishment” is the natural order He designed and a sense of which He imparted as a gift of creation.

God’s pattern with peoples and civilizations before intervention in the past often has been not to bring punishment until the sin reaches its fullness. Biblically, this is seen in multiple examples. Consider God’s comment concerning the Amorites in Genesis 15:16, that He would not bring Israel into the land until after some time had passed, “for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet complete.” Does that mean that the Amorites were a people to whom God had revealed His truth, like He has to His Church, and that he was waiting for them to fall away from that divine revelation? Of course not. They were already a people removed from the standards of God in their behavior and understanding, but God says they had further to fall away from those standards before He planned to intervene. Frankly, we see the same in God’s ultimate dealings with Israel, in which He gave them so much time to change, but eventually time was up.

We see it with Jonah’s being sent to Nineveh.  Were the people of Ninevah a called people of God in the sense that they had His laws, were keeping His Sabbaths and Holy Days, and were abiding by His commandments? I see no evidence whatsoever that they were. They were not set apart in the same way Israel was, nor were they given God’s laws like Israel was (cf. Deut. 4:7-8). And did they return to the entirety of God’s law after Jonah’s preaching and prophesying–the entirety of a law which was not fully revealed to them? No, they surely did not. But they did respond in the ways they understood to respond? Yes. Did they repent of at least those things their natures told them were wrong? Yes (Jonah 3:7-9). But more importantly, did God recognize the difference for His purposes at that time? Yes, He did, and he delayed their destruction (Jonah 3:10). Not having the fullness of God’s revealed truth did not prevent them from, as a civilization, having fallen even further from those inherent standards of right and wrong God has allowed to exist in all human beings, nor did it mean that God did not care if they were falling further from those standards or seeking to return to them. Clearly, He did.

The pattern of waiting until “transgressors have reached their fullness” (Dan. 8:23) is a biblical theme, describing the actions of the God of the Bible. And these very biblical ideas–that iniquity may be present without yet being complete, that transgression may not have yet reached its fullness, and that a people without the full revelation of the law can still be held accountable for rebelling against the part they do naturally know and then even shown some mercy for returning to that part–mean that it is possible for those who live in a fallen state with regard to the truth to fall further away, and that those who live in a state of general rebellion can still rebel to greater extent. The idea that one who is in a state of being apart from the fullness of the truth cannot fall away or rebel in a more climactic sense simply has no biblical basis at all.

There are many examples and relevant passages one could review. I will use only one more before I begin to beat the dead horse too excessively… Consider what Paul says of the Gentiles in Romans 1:18-32. It is correctly taken axiomatically that the Gentiles he speaks of, such as in the Greco-Roman world, did not have the special revelation of God concerning all of His beautiful law and understanding, yet he stresses that they had at least that which could be naturally known, from the world around them (v.20) to their own natural design (v.28), and that–even without the fullness of the spiritual revelation–God held them accountable for their rebellion and their falling away from what they did know, explaining that they were choosing not to retain God in their minds (v.28), even if that understanding would have been limited, and that for this rebellion they were deserving of death (v.32).

Anyone who claims that it is impossible for those who don’t have the full truth of God to fall further away from God or to rebel to an even deeper extent simply haven’t read enough of their Bibles. (And I would have been such an “anyone” in the far enough past, but thankfully the Bible’s a hard book to resist!) And those who think God doesn’t notice when organizations like the Boy Scouts make the sorts of decisions like they have recently and doesn’t consider it a worsening of their state and a further distancing themselves from God also don’t seem to know their Bible.

In 2 Timothy 3:1-5, Paul describes the End Time state of affairs:

“But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away!”

In the verses afterwards, he describes the impact of this attitude on the Church, specifically, including its reflection in events of his time. But it would be dangerously foolish to think that because he addresses that description in the context of its impact on and within the Church that he is not speaking of a condition that will be true for the whole world, in general. Who would think that?

And we see this state coming into shape in our world right before our very eyes.

However incompletely and imperfectly, to the extent they understood it the Boy Scouts sought to reflect a “love of God” in their organization, and enshrined that love in their oath. Their desire to impart moral goodness to boys and young men had a semblance of godliness. But in embracing something unholy, they step closer to being despisers of good, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, and to denying any power or authority in the form of godliness they seek to maintain. If we don’t see in the Boy Scouts’ decision yet another step toward the world described by 2 Timothy 3, then we aren’t looking.

As Paul says, from such people turn away.

19 thoughts on “The Boy Scouts and America’s growing rebellion against God

  1. WOW, what a “massive missive” on your part. You obviously see how nonsensical it is to compromise with or even reject universal values for the sake of peace in the name of group values.

    Having a separate “Gay Scouts” would make “better carnal sense” than this. 😛

  2. The pattern of waiting until “transgressors have reached their fullness” (Dan. 8:23) is a biblical theme, describing the actions of the God of the Bible. And these very biblical ideas–that iniquity may be present without yet being complete, that transgression may not have yet reached its fullness, and that a people without the full revelation of the law can still be held accountable for rebelling against the part they do naturally know and then even shown some mercy for returning to that part–mean that it is possible for those who live in a fallen state with regard to the truth to fall further away, and that those who live in a state of general rebellion can still rebel to greater extent. The idea that one who is in a state of being apart from the fullness of the truth cannot fall away or rebel in a more climactic sense simply has no biblical basis at all. (…)


  3. obeirne

    I can only say that you’ve hit the nail on the head, Mr. Smith. Satan deceives the whole world and this Trogan Horse strategy has all the hallmarks of his cunning!

  4. [Commenter's name redacted]

    [EDIT: Howdy, ma’am! I hope you don’t mind, but I have removed or edited some little details here and there in this comment as well as your name so that the identity of any individual you may be talking about can’t be deduced from what you’ve said. I like to be careful about that sort of stuff. However, it doesn’t mean that I don’t sympathize with your circumstances. I can understand your frustration, and I’m sorry that you’re having to deal with all of that! — WGS]

    This “GAY” movement keeps seeping in little by little, and I can ATTEST to THAT on such a personal level as well. I’ve had a gay relative for several years now, that my father was KNOWN for keeping a very far arm’s length of a DISTANCE from! It was EVIDENT at ANY family gatherings, that my father was NOT going to change his opinion of how VILE this person had degenerated to becoming! The sicker my father became, the more soul searching we all think he became, since towards the end, he DID reach out to this individual upon their NAMING their molester from [a certain time and place in the past].

    It was NOT reciprocated, as you can well imagine by that late of a date, from the homosexual relative. They thought daddy was just doing a “deathbed repentance” of sorts, so they spitefully would NOT give dad his much needed release of guilt he must’ve felt to have tried to make peace like he did.

    NOW that dad’s GONE, it’s quite TELLING how the DEMON HAS BEEN AWAKENED in this gay relative who has NOW begun to DIVIDE and conquer amongst our German relation of family members!!! Not ONLY have they stopped speaking to ME personally, (after reading a LCG article about God’s views about homosexuality, on my fb wall post), but they’ve proceeded to BLOCK ME, as well as inspiring a long lost cousin of ours to BLOCK ME as well, for NO apparent reason, since she and I had JUST re-connected after decades!!!

    This divisive spirit has NOT ceased there, they will NO longer take ANY PHONE CALLS from me, I’ve sent a TEXT to them, while watching them across the parking lot from their apt., only to WITNESS them ignoring the text after looking at it on their phone, while walking their dog – when they proceeded to slip the phone BACK into their pocket.

    They’re “camping out” at my mom’s now too, (which my father would’ve NOT allowed – so AGAIN, this is QUITE an intrusion on the available time others of us can visit with mom, w/out having to listen to the gay member’s “views on tolerance, their NEW AGE beliefs of mumbo jumbo, details about their scary “meditation cruises” where they get all “primal” & scream away their negative chakra intrusions, like a pack of WILD animals, they now have miniature Buddah statues all over their apt., & have declared bankruptcy, despite the fact that they drive a flashy BMW???

    We’ve SEEN this gathering storm of rebellion, gaining its head of steam from this individual who was born and raised in WCG, hence their seemingly diabolical HATE level toward any semblance of remnant of God’s church that they come in contact with. Being the MOVING target that we are, and just the fact that my son got to see his three grown siblings at dad’s memorial, who visited from NC, we WILL be moving further AWAY from this HATE monger. I want my son nowhere near such a “Unity” believing hypocrite, who goes around with pressed together hands, bowing and wishing all “Namaste” but is the ANTITHESIS of this “peaceful” pursuit of “religion” they’ve been embracing, even to the degree now of attending “water meditation classes?” Needless to say, we WON’T be missing all of the chatter about the drum circles this individual attends, nor the “Swami” level they’ve been elevated to, while wearing a rust colored floor length GOWN, along with a leather necklace, decorated with feathers and wooden beads!!!

    OY!!!! Let’s just say, when the patriarch of the family died, SO DID THE CIVILIZED behavior of a few family members, so we’re NOT going to miss being too close to THIS “train wreck” of a once close family ANY longer!!! The unraveling is NOT going to be witnessed by us any longer, so as soon as this [year] of high school ends, and [other things are finished], we’re moving BACK to NC where we lived for 20 years, for a number of reasons, but THIS occurrance is one of the MAIN recent ones!!!! 😦

    Thanks for a wall to VENT upon. . .just having another one of those “THY KINGDOM COME” moments!! ;-/

    With respectful submitting of this comment,

    [Initials redacted]

  5. Hey Mr. Smith… thanks for the excellent commentary. Good job on showing the continuing and ongoing and obvious fulfillment of 2 Thessalonians 2:3, in a practical manner. The world around us is steadily turning away from God, despising His laws, and becoming more and more corrupt.

    Hope you had a good Feast of Weeks!


  6. Interesting blog.

    What the Boy Scouts of America are basically saying is, “we, as an organization, don’t really care if immoral activities are allowed by our leadership – we just won’t look.”

    How would this decision by the Boy Scouts of America be any different than myself obtaining a subscription to Playboy magazine – telling myself, “I’ll just read the news stories and not look at the centerfold”.

    God’s statute against homosexuality withstanding, immoral justification – in any form – is a sin and breaks God’s 9th Commandment: You shall not lie. God didn’t say, “You shall not lie – unless you tell YOURSELF (or your organization) a lie – then that’s alright.” God said – “You shall not lie” – period.

    Like homosexuality, telling a lie is an abomination to the one, true living Creator God – Proverbs 12:17.

  7. You said a great deal with this statement “if the will of the sponsors makes no difference …” I understand that your comments are directed at the national organization run by professionals, but I’d like to remind your readership that 61% of the families and volunteer leadership at the unit level did not want this change! Many are working on transition plans to separate ourselves from an organization that worked against the will of its own membership in steamroller fashion … its important to distinguish the dedicated “remnant” who have served youth faithfully under God’s leading within BSA…now saddened but moving forward.

  8. Thanks for your comments, Troop113, and you have my sympathies. I never completed scouting, but I was a Cub Scout and a Webelo Scout, I have always admired the organization, and I count two Eagle Scouts among my friends. When a BSA leader told our Church camp recently, “Wow, you guys should come back and train our scouts!” I took that as a high complement. I know that this is a difficult time for your orgainzation and the boys you seek to shepherd into manhood, and those like you, caught between doing the right thing and seeing such changes in an organization you love, are on our minds. Thanks, again, for the comment, and–regardless of what may come of the organzation–if you have a true map and faithful compass I am sure you will find your way in the decisions y’all have ahead.

  9. Norbert

    The scenario happening to the BSA reminds me of the adage about the frog in a pot. So I wonder if there will be a similar Roe vs. Wade moment occurring in the future.

    In human terms it’s been several generations from the time when our society promoted being chaste outside of marriage and divorce would dramatically affect a person’s social standing. Nowadays being chaste outside of marriage is viewed as impractical by many and divorce is mostly just a statistical talking point.

    The way I see it, what’s happening with the BSA is turning the heat up another degree to the larger pot. And that larger pot can have something to do with the values being stated in a youtube vid John D Carmack posted on his blog a short time ago.

  10. Thank you for the encouragement, Pastor! We need it! Psalm 119:105 – God’s word is our map and our flashlight for our path. Interestingly, our troop-designed patch for summer camp includes Isaiah 58:11 as a reference — as we fast from scouting while being guided to our next youth program which is grounded in Him. – Scoutmaster, Paul Farrell, Troop 113 (Psalm 1:1-3)

  11. Teresa

    Thanks for your post, Mr. Smith. I had heard several days ago that the Scouts were making this decision, but hadn’t heard the outcome until reading your post. I’m glad to see the post from Troop 113 saying that some are making plans to continue an organization that does uphold morality. It seems to me that if a boy considers himself “gay”, then there is already some element of sexuality coming into play in that young person’s mind or experience. It seems inconceivable that any parent with even a modicum of concern for their child would send their child off on activities when there could be a possibility for any type of sexual encounter, either with an adult or with another child.
    You mentioned cold calculations in reference to this decision, and that is the same type of calculating that David Kupelian speaks of in his book, The Marketing of Evil. As horrific as it is, there are people who have been patiently and persistently pushing an agenda of perversion onto our American society to the point that people call “evil good, and good evil”. Of course, we understand the spirit behind all this. It will be such a blessing when Satan is bound and his influence is removed.

  12. warningtoamerica

    Paraphrasing the famous declaration made by Neil Armstrong:

    The Eagle has crashed and burned…

    When will this nation WAKE UP?!!!


    An aging Eagle Scout….

  13. obeirne

    I’m pleased to hear that there are those in the American Boy Scout Movement who are going to break away because of this abominable decision. However, please excuse me if I digress for a moment: The curse of homosexuality has sunk to new depths here in Europe. The Cannes Film Festival has awarded the best film prize to a film called Blue Is the Warmest Colour and it purports to be a ” love ” story. The ” lovers ” and two main characters are an older woman and a 15 year old girl. If this film, rather than a fictional depiction of the sexual abuse of a minor, was a real life situation surely there would be a criminal prosecution? However news that this film has won this prestigious prize is getting, by and large, more positive AND negative publicity. No newscaster/interviewer or commentator is posing the legality of a film promoting the sexual abuse of a young girl, although there is criticism of the explicit scenes of sexual activity in the film. Obviously that in itself is a major reason to demand the film be banned, but the core issue is that of the film romanticizing and legitimizing the sexual abuse of a minor and of perverted sexual acts. I did send an e-mail pointing out what I’ve stated here to SKY NEWS, a sister company of FOX NEWS, but there has been no change in the manner in which they are dealing with the story. I wonder how FOX NEWS will deal with it. Sorry for that long, drawn-out ” moment ” I’ve taken to ” vent my spleen “, but I needed to say it to somebody.

  14. Kathy Williams

    And speaking of films, I just received an email from a gal pal in California, who attends with The Seventh Day Adventist group. She was telling me of a movie about to be released between June – August, entitled “Corpus Christi” (The Body of Christ), in which Christ and his disciples will be portrayed as what they’d have been like if homosexual men!!!!???? Apparently, this has already been a stage play, and will now be shown as a movie!!! 😦 So JUST when we THINK we’ve heard it all, yet another Satanic notion gets carried out to the most SICKENING forms of “entertainment” once more!!! Thank you too btw in advance btw, for any/all editing of comments. YOU are QUITE appreciated kind sir!!! 🙂

  15. Greetings, “K”, and thanks for the comment. I’m assuming that by “men like you” you mean me or some of those who have commented here. If so, I’m not sure what aspects of teaching boys about what God says about being a man would break your heart. But if I’m assuming wrong, and you’re trying to say that it’s heart breaking to see an organization that claims to boys what it means to be a man so dramatically lose its moral footing, then I agree with you.

    Thanks, again.

  16. Pingback: Boy Scouts – reaction | Trutherator's Weblog

  17. Pingback: Misaligned Objectives May Lead to Unintended Results | Troop 113's Blog

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